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Marston VC
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
579
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Posted - 2013.07.15 06:29:00 -
[1] - Quote
I read a couple posts a moment ago and it made me wonder..... how easy should it be? My opinion would be biased..... I know this because since day 1 we've never not had at-least 1 district. Not to mention isk kind of loses its value after your corp hits "critical mass" in terms of member count. So I mean...... What do you guys think? What is the biggest problem with PC right now? Because im not really sure......
IF YOU WANT TO READ MY OPINION GO AHEAD, BUT THE ABOVE MENTIONED IS MORE OR LESS THE "QUESTION".
So..... My general opinion on the situation is that somethings gotta change....... Currently, it costs 30M isk to buy one starter pack. If your a new corp your limited to either attacking with starter packs, or brokering a deal with one of the bigger corps. The broker deal is easier, and honestly the safer of the two choices, however it kind of lacks the whole feeling of accomplishment you get out of conquering land yourself. So what other option do new corps have but to swallow the pill and buy starter packs? Well.... that's it, that's the only other way. So that's a 30M investment for 1 attack. Most districts a player attacks will have more then 150 clones on it, therefore a second starter pack will almost always be required, with a third starter pack not being that surprising. So what we have here is a 60M investment at the very least, and that's only assuming your corp "wins" the battle. Ok so 60M plus the losses the corp took in battle. Fair enough. I think it might be a bit difficult for newer corps to break into PC. I mean..... shouldn't the system promote small 'upstart' growth while slowing down rapid growth? In other words, I feel like the system should be built in a way were its easy to get into PC but hard to become "prominent" or "big" in PC.
The only solution that I can think of right now is to just open up more districts. Im not going to say that the space we have right now is "too" small, but its not very big..... cramped even. Its not like every district has 1 battle per day on it, but there just isn't enough land for newer corps to tap into. There is no "hidden corner" out there. Were limited two 5 systems in 1 region. Its pretty easy to find everyone and anyone whos participating in PC. Plus if you think about it...... whats the point of having a clone attrition value if the attacking force loses hardly anything from planet to planet??? Basically we have a ton of power blocks all cramped closely together with nowhere to have any breathing room. The small corps that do participate are only allowed to because the larger corps allow it.
In other words the bullies have taken over the sandbox, and theres no more room for the kids to play because the sandbox is just too small for it.
Don't get me wrong..... I think PC should be something corps have to work up to, but at the same time im not sure if its right that nobody can get a district without either A.) beating impossible odds, or B.) asking somebody for permission first.....
Idk..... im kind of tired so this all seems a lot like a rant now that I look at it, but what else could I do at midnight anyway? No clue...... |
Marston VC
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
579
|
Posted - 2013.07.15 06:36:00 -
[2] - Quote
Xero The Mishima wrote:Marston VC wrote:I read a couple posts a moment ago and it made me wonder..... how easy should it be? My opinion would be biased..... I know this because since day 1 we've never not had at-least 1 district. Not to mention isk kind of loses its value after your corp hits "critical mass" in terms of member count. So I mean...... What do you guys think? What is the biggest problem with PC right now? Because im not really sure......
IF YOU WANT TO READ MY OPINION GO AHEAD, BUT THE ABOVE MENTIONED IS MORE OR LESS THE "QUESTION".
So..... My general opinion on the situation is that somethings gotta change....... Currently, it costs 30M isk to buy one starter pack. If your a new corp your limited to either attacking with starter packs, or brokering a deal with one of the bigger corps. The broker deal is easier, and honestly the safer of the two choices, however it kind of lacks the whole feeling of accomplishment you get out of conquering land yourself. So what other option do new corps have but to swallow the pill and buy starter packs? Well.... that's it, that's the only other way. So that's a 30M investment for 1 attack. Most districts a player attacks will have more then 150 clones on it, therefore a second starter pack will almost always be required, with a third starter pack not being that surprising. So what we have here is a 60M investment at the very least, and that's only assuming your corp "wins" the battle. Ok so 60M plus the losses the corp took in battle. Fair enough. I think it might be a bit difficult for newer corps to break into PC. I mean..... shouldn't the system promote small 'upstart' growth while slowing down rapid growth? In other words, I feel like the system should be built in a way were its easy to get into PC but hard to become "prominent" or "big" in PC.
The only solution that I can think of right now is to just open up more districts. Im not going to say that the space we have right now is "too" small, but its not very big..... cramped even. Its not like every district has 1 battle per day on it, but there just isn't enough land for newer corps to tap into. There is no "hidden corner" out there. Were limited two 5 systems in 1 region. Its pretty easy to find everyone and anyone whos participating in PC. Plus if you think about it...... whats the point of having a clone attrition value if the attacking force loses hardly anything from planet to planet??? Basically we have a ton of power blocks all cramped closely together with nowhere to have any breathing room. The small corps that do participate are only allowed to because the larger corps allow it.
In other words the bullies have taken over the sandbox, and theres no more room for the kids to play because the sandbox is just too small for it.
Don't get me wrong..... I think PC should be something corps have to work up to, but at the same time im not sure if its right that nobody can get a district without either A.) beating impossible odds, or B.) asking somebody for permission first.....
Idk..... im kind of tired so this all seems a lot like a rant now that I look at it, but what else could I do at midnight anyway? No clue...... We try our hardest to get everybody small or medium corps into PC (Team Players) We even offer protection against big corps to our clients. Don't get no easier than that.
Okayyyy but that's only because you allow them to isn't it? Its not like they could ever say no to any condition you impose..... |
Marston VC
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
579
|
Posted - 2013.07.15 17:38:00 -
[3] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:The changes to the attrition values seemed like a cop out to me. CCP screwed themselves by allowing anyone to buy a clone pack at any time and we all knew this would result in using them to circumvent the attrition system. Lowering the attrition to disincentivise clone pack attacks from those with districts just makes attrition pointless. My guess is that people will still use clone packs, so that none of their districts becomes vulnerable after shipping out clones. And the lower isk cost for clone packs will only make this worse.
I still argue that restricting the clone packs to those without districts would have been the better choice. At least then if big corps wanted to make use of alt corps to get around the restriction it would have been a bit of a chore for them and increasingly difficult to manage over time. Instead they've been given free reign and unlimited numbers of clones for now very cheap.
Localised fighting was not huge before, now it will be irrelevant.
I just hope True Grit have the balls to go back to the clone pack restriction when they open up the next region. Molden Heath has already gone too far.
Hmmm well what they did was definitely surprising, however the new attrition values actually reflect the game eve online much better then the old ones. In eve it can take well over 100 jumps to get from one side of the game to the other, so losing most of your clones by the 8 jump mark (in the old version) would kind of sucked if they opened up more regions. I like to look at this as a preparation for more land to be opened. Sure it might be cheaper to buy a starter pack, BUT you only get 100 clones, which is risky if you know your playing a tough corp, not to mention that its impossible to make a double attack happen if you buy a starter pack. So if anything I think CCP is setting the PC mechanics up better for the future (when theres much more space). The only thing we need now is some incentive to own these districts..... other then making 10M per day off clone sales that is. What we need is more infrastructure, PVE that is enhanced if you own districts, and other benefits to owning districts as well, like industry. |
Marston VC
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
579
|
Posted - 2013.07.15 17:40:00 -
[4] - Quote
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:Isn't this part of what makes New Eden a harsh place to be?
I'm all for helping new corps out. EoN has been doing allot of work in that regard, especialy Team Players, but at the same time, it's a risk / reward system.
New corps have options available to them, so it's up to them really. There's quite a few small corps in PC atm that newer corps can attack.
I won't suggest attacking the bigger, well established ones. Common sense would dictate stay away from big alliances or talk to them about getting started.
Smaller corps been attacking us lately funny enough. I guess they figured there's a war going on, so we'll be too busy. I give them props, but at the same I question their actions.
Even IF they manage to take a district off us, then what? They expect to stay there?
I mean if they're looking to test themselves out, cool. But if they're planning on taking districts, not being arrogant or anything, but attacking smaller corps is the better way to go about it.
That's not much of a choice though is it??? Small corps being limited to a small piece of space because the big corps say "yeahhhh you guys can get some space here if you wrestle it off some of the other small corps we let go there first" I mean.... lol so much for choice! |
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